Does God Want Us to Be Poor? Redefining Wealth, Money and Spirituality

In this episode of "Leaving the Church to Find God," host Melissa Whittington explores the intersection of money and spirituality. Discover how to overcome money shame, challenge limiting beliefs from religious teachings, and redefine wealth from a spiritual perspective. Learn practical tips for cultivating a healthy money mindset and hear insights from Amanda Frances' "Rich as F*ck." This episode will help you align your financial goals with your spiritual values. Visit livealau.com for more insights and connect with us on Instagram. I've created a meditation to accompany this episode. It leads you through an energetic lifting of the veil of poverty and elevates your mind to the frequency of joyful abundance. You can find the meditation here.

Transcript

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(Transcribed by TurboScribe.ai. Go Unlimited to remove this message.) Aloha, God Pod, welcome back. I am Catherine Melissa Whittington, your host. If this is your first time coming here, thank you for being here. If you are a repeat listener, thank you for being here. I appreciate you all so much and I am really, feel a lot of purpose in bringing this conversation forward today. I am not a 50 million dollar coach, you know right now. I'm not coming here from Buddha on the mountaintop. I'm coming here in the trenches with you to talk about money and abundance. So, today is August 8th. A year ago, for those of you who aren't aware, on Maui we had massive, massive fires all over the island. It burned down the entire town of Lahaina, which was the Hawaiian kingdom. It hosted many, many generations of local families who still are not housed and it was devastating. It was devastating to, in so many ways. So many lives were lost and in honoring that, I want to bring us to a place that returns to joy and abundance. So, here on Maui, we are very much dependent on tourism. We don't have to be, but thanks to greed and corruption, we are. And every time there's something that happens that, that halts tourism, it affects everyone here deeply. Not everyone, but those who are the working class get very deeply affected because even if your business is a business that serves local families, many of those families are dependent on tourism. So, it just being in the service industry and the hospitality industry, you know, most of the people I know are massage therapists or photographers. Like, it's just, that's what we do here and it has had a great impact on us. But I know that that impact is not just here. It's something like financially, you know, lack of money and, and scarcity. It tends to be something that continues to repeat for people. And this experience in Maui has really, you know, coming out of COVID where we were very deeply affected and completely shut down, which I appreciate and I understand the reason for it. It also depleted many of us, including myself financially, all of my, you know, clear debt, you know, I had no debt and big savings and I was doing really well. And then COVID happened. I got long COVID, which has been a three-year journey. And just as I was starting to catch up, the island caught on fire. Not to say this because I'm looking for sympathy, but because it forced me, it forced me to go deep. And I've spent the last year trying to make ends meet and, and digging into my money wounds and my money blocks and this feeling of scarcity that it seems like I'm either working myself into, you know, an oblivion and having very little social life or personal life and just working all the time to be abundant or I'm, you know, in lack. And I know, because I know my source, because I know who I am, that that is not the natural state for myself or for any of us. So this past year has really, really forced me to go deep into this, whether I wanted to or not. And I'm grateful for it because I have come to some really great insights and I feel compelled to share them with you here today, not as Buddha on the mountaintop again, but as someone in the trenches. And even from this place of recovery, I can say these things with confidence and full, complete knowing. So I'm going to start with the church because that's what we do, right? And many of us have heard these teachings in church that discourage wealth and put shame around financial success. There's scriptures like Matthew 19, 24, where Jesus says it's easier for a camel to go through the eye of a needle than for someone who's rich to enter the kingdom of God, or for a rich man to go to heaven, depending on which version you're reading. There's first Timothy 6 and 10, which says for the love of money is the root of all kinds of evil. And these things have been used to instill fear and guilt about wealth. One thing about wielding, you'll hear me say over and over again, how I just, I'm not a Bible thumper. Like I'm, there's value in there, sure. There's also a lot of bullshit in there. So I don't depend on scripture and I don't throw scripture around, but I'm showing how these are used and how often what happens with scripture is one thing is taken to benefit the church and used out of context and, or without context, and used to control and manipulate people. And these teachings, they have historical roots since early Christianity. There was a strong emphasis on asceticism and renunciation of material possessions as a path to spiritual purity. This perspective is not just in Christianity and Catholicism too. I mean, look at Mother Teresa, God bless her. But this was this glorification of poverty, right? This perspective, it's been reinforced by various church leaders whose teachings may have been well intended, but they often resulted in a negative perception of wealth and of the people who pursued it. And no matter how much we desire abundance and wealth, if there's some part of us that believes that it's evil or that in having wealth, it's going to make us bad or make us not loved by God, then our subconscious is so much stronger than our conscious awareness that it's going to continue to lead us into these situations of lack and of scarcity. But also we could look into the church and see how troubling it is, all of these megachurches and their leaders, because these leaders are often preaching these same messages about the virtues of humility and poverty, but they're living these lavish lifestyles funded by their congregations. They're also not paying taxes. They justify their wealth by claiming it's a sign of God's favor, like, look how much God is lifting me up, but they're discouraged by the fact that they're discouraging their followers from seeking financial success. And not only is it hypocritical to demonize wealth for a congregation when it's being celebrated in its leadership, but it's also very manipulative, right? Because the thing that the church depends on is need, need and scarcity, right? It's God can give you all these things that you're lacking. And when you're empowered and you have everything that you need, you're a lot less likely to be manipulated by these teachings. That's not to say that there aren't people with money in the church or that the people with money in the church are bad, but especially if you look in our political landscape now, a lot of the evangelicals and people who are claiming to be Christian and are living wealthy, they're not in the church because of their love for God. They're in the church because it is helping them to perpetuate dynamics that they, that are benefiting them, usually white men. And no, I'm not demonizing white men. I'm not demonizing white women. I'm not demonizing whiteness. I'm not demonizing anything. I'm just pointing out that often the people in power keep that power by subjugating others. And that is certainly what we've seen in patriarchy and white supremacy, which is built within our systems here and all around the world. So it doesn't go without mentioning because it's important. It is part of what we're seeing. And if you look at the politics nowadays and the politicians who are claiming to be Christians and then how they live, even the, one of the nominees for the 2024 election, you know, has been a con man his entire life and career and is being put on a pedestal like he's been chosen by God for whatever reason. And that's because of brainwashing and manipulation and control. And this is easier to do when people are in lack, when people need something. And it's, you know, the church likes to use this like punishing dynamic of God. And we've talked about this before, like the punishing God and that if God's not pleased with you, you're not going to be abundant. So you're stuck in this scarcity mindset and it's buried in your subconscious and you're constantly self-sabotaging without even realizing it. And it creates, it just perpetuates and deepens the struggle. And through that struggle, you know, there's more and more created, which makes us continue to feel like we're not pleasing God. So we do more and we give more and we give more offering and we give more ties and we give more of our free time, free labor to the church. And we give and give and give just trying to make God happy so that we can be blessed. And I invite you to consider that that is an endless spiral downward. There is no end to it. Trust me, I did all the volunteering. I did all of the work. I did the tithing and I did the offering and I did it. And all it ever left me was feeling worse and worse. So I want to challenge some of these limiting beliefs. Again, these teachings are often used to serve the leaders and to control followers by promoting this, you know, virtuous idea of poverty and that wealth is inherently bad. And it leads us to have eventually have a fear-based mindset around money. So it's even if we're trying so hard and we're following all the steps and working to build things, if deep down we believe that, you know, again, that this is going to make us bad or make God not like us, then we're going to continue to self-sabotage. But think about again, I'm going to bring it back because although I don't see Source or God as an entity, it is a consciousness. It is an energy. It is everything. It's me talking right now. It's the computer that's recording me. It's the air that I'm breathing. Like it's Source. Everything comes from Source, right? So everything is of Source. And that Source is pure abundance. It is pure abundance and we are a reflection of that Source, which means that we are pure abundance. So I'm going to talk about I am. In the Bible, there is this reference, I am the great I am. Like God is the great I am. And the great thing about that is that I am is infinite. I am wealth. I am love. I am abundance. I am health. I am vibrancy. I am joy. What we say we are, what we speak into existence, is what we are. We are inherently connected to all aspects of existence. I am Melissa. I am everything. I am. That's the thing. It's like you can't take that away from someone. A person is always their own I am, right? It may get a little deep, but just kind of giving an idea so that you can recognize our inherent worth and potential. When we recognize that we are connected to all aspects of existence, including abundance, then we can tap into that Source, right? So we can begin to dismantle these beliefs that have been completely imposed on us. And we can start to shift our mindset to allow us to see wealth not as a source of guilt or something bad, but as a tool for positive change. So if you look, of course, there are exceptions like to everything. You know, you've got the Walmart chick that is a bazillionaire and not working for the greater good. But especially with women, like when you put wealth in the hands of women, you can look at what they do with it. There's the majority of women are very charitable and working towards, you know, the greater good of humanity with their wealth. And so I believe that, you know, not that mentioned me wealthy, too, but but it's clear, you know, with the wage gap and in the way that we've been taught, especially as women, that humility is like key and being humble. And it's created this dependence also, you know, perpetuated by patriarchy. So I'm speaking to women and men, but specifically when women have wealth, which has been discouraged, we see much different things happening with it. And the thing about money is money is not evil. Money is not the root of evil. Money is an amplifier. If you are an asshole and you get a bunch of money, you're Elon Musk. You're going to do a bunch of asshole stuff with it. He's like the supervillain in the movies that is enacting revenge on everybody that makes him mad and spewing out all of his hate and using his money to control and manipulate everything that he doesn't like, like a giant petulant baby. He's got this money and he's using it. That's an amplifier of who he is. And then you look at people like Sarah Blakely, who was the creator of Spanx, who is a billionaire, who by her own right, not off the backs of other people, her company, her employees have been paid fair wages. Even when she went public with her company and put it on the stock market, every single employee that worked for Spanx got a round trip ticket for their whole family to wherever they wanted to go and $10,000 to go spend on vacation as a reward. So there's the difference. It's an amplifier of who she is. She took her wealth and she takes her wealth and they do these events, her and her husband at their home, and they live abundantly and they enjoy their life, but they also use their money to amplify who they are, which is to create good in the world. She has educational programs in Africa, educating girls that would otherwise be spending all of their day walking to go get water for the family, to give them a chance in their life. She's using that wealth, like so many others, to amplify the goodness, to amplify who she is. And that's what money is. Money is neutral. Money isn't good or bad. Money is an amplifier. So think about that. Consider how the message is, what you've heard about money and how that's impacted your relationship. Like deep down, even though you know you need money to survive, which is how they can use it so easily to manipulate because our survival depends on it, it activates the fear within us. And think about how money has activated and created a sense of fear, right? So I had this huge awakening the other day and I was listening to Erin Lyons. She's amazing. My new favorite person to listen to. And she said something that just really clicked, but it was interesting because I went into the conversation. I was like, there's something in here for me. And I spoke to my higher self. I was like, whatever it is, let me hear it. There's something here that is meant to change me. Let me hear it. Let me really hear it. Let it shift me. And it did. It shifted me so hard. What I realized and learned is that money is a consciousness, just like everything. You know, we talk about AI, you know, is created. Sure, it's technology, but it also has a consciousness. Everything that's created has a consciousness. And, you know, souls, I believe in reincarnation. For me, it's quite obvious, you know, believe how you want to believe. But my understanding is that, you know, our soul chooses what we're going to do in this life. Wherever our souls came from, they come here with a purpose. And again, we're not a slave to our purpose, right? We have free will. We have choice in the matter, but our souls know what it wanted to accomplish. So when we work in alignment with that, it's going to lead to a more joyful and expansive life because we're living in alignment with our truth. And on a little side note, you know, so many people say love is the highest frequency. And I challenge that and say that truth is the highest frequency. And love is a result of truth. But there's nothing more true than true, right? There's nothing more real than truth. So within that is love. And I believe that, you know, a source is a source of unconditional love. And that when we live in a place of unconditional love, that we feel that expansiveness in our souls and that joy, it comes as a result of that. But it's in that saying that is to see that money is also an expression of love. It's a way of supporting us and a way of creating with us. But also realizing that money has a consciousness. Just like I have a soul that chose to come here and be Melissa. And whatever timeline or whatever reality and whoever else I've been, it will be am all at the same time. But I'm Melissa right now. I am Melissa. That's my consciousness. So my consciousness is here as Melissa. So money has a consciousness. There was a soul that agreed to it. I'll be money. I will go and I will be money. And money gets here because this soul's thinking, cool, I get to like work with humans through all these senses to create amazing things. Like they can come up with it in their minds. They can create these ideas and these desires. And I get to be their partner in creating these desires. Like how fun is that? But then money gets here and it's being used to control and enslave and manipulate. And people feel imprisoned to it. People feel victim of it. People hate it. People have all these bad things to say. And money's like, whoa, what did I do? Like I'm neutral here, friend. Like we can be besties. And that really shook me because I realized that I have been a prisoner to money. I have felt victimized by money. And I have worked so much on being a victim, victim mindset, clearing that up, empowering myself. But I didn't realize that I've been living in this prison of I am a victim of money. Money is bad. Money is letting me down. There's never enough. There's, it's always a disappointment. Like why isn't there more of it? I need more of it so that I can do this. I can do that. And I'm scared. And is these feelings, these negative feelings about money? And so I thought about this in, like, if I were in a relationship, if I were dating someone or if I were friends with someone and every time I came near them, they were like, is that all you got? Like, couldn't you have brought more with you? Like, or, you know, telling me that I'm evil or that I'm always like not enough, or I'm a disappointment, or I'm controlling them, or I'm not showing up for them in the way that I'm supposed to. I would not want to be with that person. And so when we think about money as a consciousness, think about that. Like, are we creating a hospitable and loving environment for money to come into? When I think about, okay, when money shows up for me, I can do, it can amplify who I am. It can make me more of who I am. It can give me the freedom to choose from day to day how I use my energy and how I create. When money comes to me, I use it to create a ripple effect and to create a positive impact on the world. When money comes to me, we have fun and we go on vacations and we go on pick up the check when we go out to dinner with our friends. And we buy pretty things that make our eyes happy and delicious things that make our taste buds happy and our nose happy. And we can do all of this amazing, wonderful work with money because it is neutral. And what we do with it is up to us. So Amanda Francis is someone who I've been following for a very long time. And she has this very Valley girl voice. So at first I was like, oh my God, but her words were so powerful. I couldn't stop listening to them. Right. And when I listened to her, it literally shifts something in me, my vibration shifts. And I was listening to her book, Rich as Fuck. And she's very unapologetic about money. She was a theologian. She also grew up in an evangelical cult and, um, had these same limiting beliefs around money and was becoming, you know, first she went to school for theology and learned so much about religion and the Bible and all of this. And then she went to school to become like a therapist. And while she was doing that, she decided to start coaching and she has in turn created a very, very abundant life for herself. But she wrote this book, Rich as Fuck, and I highly recommend it. Um, she emphasizes this and she really breaks it down into the like biblical parts of it and the religious parts of it. If you want to go deeper into that conversation. Um, and you know, she's, she really shows you how this work and how it amplifies our intentions. Like if we're good people with positive intentions, money will only enable us to do more good in the world. Right? Like that's my dream. I'm, I'm creating this business right now and I'm not going to go into the details, but every aspect of it is going to uplift everyone that it touches. It is uplifting everyone that it touches already. And it's meant to take me around the world in a way that uplifts women around the world and indigenous communities. So I'm really excited to share that with you. There's a big announcement coming soon in about six weeks. Um, I'll announce a date and everything, but understanding that we can use money for good. We can use it for fun. We can, it's not evil, it's neutral and it's up to us, like how we amplify that. But again, like thinking about money as something, a consciousness that is excited to co-create with us. It just created such a profound shift with me. Like I woke up the next day instead of worrying like, Oh, I've got this bill to pay and how am I going to do it? What's the right way? What's the quickest way to get money in my bank account so I can pay these bills? I woke up like, Hey bestie, what are we going to do today? Let's have some fun. Show me, show me what we can co-create. And it's made me more productive. It's put more joy into what I'm doing. And I just have this deep surrender and trust that money's going to show up for me because I'm treating with her with love. I'm creating this hospitable environment and inviting her into some co-creation of fun and joy and excitement and impact. I want to serve the world with this abundance that I'm creating. And then the source of this again, source, source energy or God, or however you see that as an expression, is the source of abundance. Like everything is created from source. That is abundance. I mean, every, I mean, just in, if you wrap your head around it, like everything and that there's no limit to it, that it's infinite, that it will continue to create and expand and create and expand. This shows that there is no lack, that scarcity and lack, they don't exist except in our mind. It's the only place they exist. There is no lack. There's nothing lacking. Everything that we need to exist or can exist can be created. It wouldn't make sense to think about as a parent, a child, I use this analogy a lot, but your child is born into the world and you're like, yep, I've got this breast milk and I could feed you, but you got to earn it. You got to prove to me your loyalty and your love. And then I'll give you just enough to stay alive. I mean, come on, that's not how it works. And our source, our creator doesn't see us that way either. We are an extension of that source. We are an extension of that creation. We are co-creators. We are the physical manifestation of co-creation. Like we can meet source in the middle with our physicality and sources, infinite abundance. And we meet in the middle and we create, we create newness and again, joy, abundance, joy, abundance. That is the vibe, right? The idea that source would withhold blessings as a form of punishment. It's just not in alignment with our true nature. It's just, it's just not. Our essence is to be abundant and joyful. The concept of a punishing God who uses lessons and withholding to control us. It's a distortion of our truth. And that is a reflection. That is an amplification of the men who put this into place. So instead recognizing that we're inherently abundant beings and the universe supports our growth and prosperity. I want to like go into some places where abundance exists outside of money. Abundance exists, abundance exists all around us and within us. Just think about how many cells are in our body, right? The cells within those cells. But as always, y'all know me, I'm going to go back to nature. Nature is just such a beautiful example of, of source and it's abundance. So like a single apple tree, think about this. It can produce hundreds of apples and each of those apples contains a seed that can grow seeds, multiple seeds that can grow into new trees that create hundreds of apples. And just think about a seed. Like you see this little hard seed. It's never, it never ceases to amaze me. I love to watch plants grow. I will go and check my little sprouts every day and just sit there and stare at them. I love to watch plants grow because it just blows my mind how this tiny little seed can open up and become like this fruitful plant, tree, like whatever. It just continues to grow and grow. Like there's no scarcity there. It, it comes with everything it needs to fully manifest, to fully self-actualize, self-actualize. So do we. Think of yourself as a seed. You're not going to come into this world without what you need to self-actualize. It doesn't work that way. But if you look at, you know, look at the ocean. It's vast. It's huge. It's filled with life and it's constantly renewing itself. The air that we breathe is abundant. The sun provides endless energy. It never runs out of energy. There's no limit to it. Just come in my yard and you'll see the abundance of weeds. No matter how much I cut them down, they're just going to keep coming back and keep coming back. Look at the abundance of humans on the planet. I would like to say the animals and other, other animals and species, but they're, they're dwindling, but there's still an abundance. I just, but even within ourselves is abundance, right? There's an abundance of love. There's an abundance of creativity. There's an abundance of potential, not just an abundance, but it's infinite. There's no end to it. And that's the real example here, right? That there is no end. Like to say abundance, you can think, Oh, there's a lot of it. And then it'll eventually run out. No, it's infinite abundance. It doesn't end its source is infinite. So like with creativity, one thing I've learned is the more I use creativity, the more of it there is. I don't run out of ideas. The more of my ideas that I act upon, the more ideas I get and I get good ideas. Y'all what I'm building right now has like 10 different facets to it. Um, because I just keep getting these amazing, like rocket ship ideas. And thanks to my neurodivergence, it's hard to focus on just one, but I have found a way to make them all work together. So it's coming, but I don't run out of creativity. The more I create, the more ideas I have, the more I want to create. I'm never worried about someone taking an idea that I have. In fact, it happens all the time. I do have like this.